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	<title>Comments on: GTA IV Countdown: Are Games Bigger Than Movies? One Expert Analyzes...</title>
	<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/</link>
	<description></description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 20:58:24 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: milo</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-54302</link>
		<dc:creator>milo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Apr 2008 14:08:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-54302</guid>
		<description>Hate to pile on, but the "loathsome" comment definitely gives the impression of a knee jerk reaction from someone who probably hasn't even played any of the games (or maybe hasn't played recent video games at all).

Interesting article, but that comment makes me take it all with a grain of salt.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hate to pile on, but the &#8220;loathsome&#8221; comment definitely gives the impression of a knee jerk reaction from someone who probably hasn&#8217;t even played any of the games (or maybe hasn&#8217;t played recent video games at all).</p>
<p>Interesting article, but that comment makes me take it all with a grain of salt.</p>
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		<title>By: gameseekr</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-54000</link>
		<dc:creator>gameseekr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 16:57:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-54000</guid>
		<description>GTA IV is big. This year(2008) is going to rake in mega bucks for game companies. Games have so many business models unlike movies and so altogether the industry will grow to me much bigger than many movies or music. 

For example with online games advertising is huge. The number of free online flash games that are being developed is staggering.

Subscription based sites like Club Penguin have done great.

Casual games are booming although the price points need to come down to the $5-$10 range. 

In game sales and micro transactions for items within games will also grow to be big. 

So if you are developing a game there are many ways to make moeny.Will see how big this all gets. 

SIMs alone brought in $4B. 

&lt;a href='http://blog.gameseekr.com/2008/04/2008-year-of-gaming.html' title='permanent link' rel="nofollow"&gt;&lt;abbr title='2008-04-15T21:47:00-07:00'&gt;9:47 PM&lt;/abbr&gt;&lt;/a&gt;

Will see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>GTA IV is big. This year(2008) is going to rake in mega bucks for game companies. Games have so many business models unlike movies and so altogether the industry will grow to me much bigger than many movies or music. </p>
<p>For example with online games advertising is huge. The number of free online flash games that are being developed is staggering.</p>
<p>Subscription based sites like Club Penguin have done great.</p>
<p>Casual games are booming although the price points need to come down to the $5-$10 range. </p>
<p>In game sales and micro transactions for items within games will also grow to be big. </p>
<p>So if you are developing a game there are many ways to make moeny.Will see how big this all gets. </p>
<p>SIMs alone brought in $4B. </p>
<p><a href='http://blog.gameseekr.com/2008/04/2008-year-of-gaming.html' title='permanent link' rel="nofollow"><abbr title='2008-04-15T21:47:00-07:00'>9:47 PM</abbr></a></p>
<p>Will see.</p>
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		<title>By: Keilwerth LA</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53991</link>
		<dc:creator>Keilwerth LA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 16:35:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53991</guid>
		<description>Video games are where it's at.  People want to disconnect and feel enveloped.  Why do you think so many people are so heavy into the various MMORPGs?  Second Life, WoW, PotBS etc.  Guys going to work, coming home and playing until they have to work again.

Wrong site to say this on, but movies are old hat; they are now secondary forms of entertainment.  I can download movies from my PC, XBox 360 or PS3 and stream them to my TV whenever I want.  Which is less and less of the time having seen the crap that keeps coming out.

And video games are just getting better.  Online play, interaction with a community, emotional highs and lows, rollercoaster stories and they're fun.

Can't remember the last time I went to movie here in LA and had fun.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Video games are where it&#8217;s at.  People want to disconnect and feel enveloped.  Why do you think so many people are so heavy into the various MMORPGs?  Second Life, WoW, PotBS etc.  Guys going to work, coming home and playing until they have to work again.</p>
<p>Wrong site to say this on, but movies are old hat; they are now secondary forms of entertainment.  I can download movies from my PC, XBox 360 or PS3 and stream them to my TV whenever I want.  Which is less and less of the time having seen the crap that keeps coming out.</p>
<p>And video games are just getting better.  Online play, interaction with a community, emotional highs and lows, rollercoaster stories and they&#8217;re fun.</p>
<p>Can&#8217;t remember the last time I went to movie here in LA and had fun.</p>
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		<title>By: ddb4</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53746</link>
		<dc:creator>ddb4</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 00:06:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53746</guid>
		<description>Slamming GTA for its violence misses the point entirely: at heart, GTA is an ironic commentary on violence in American media. That's why Vice City is a Scarface/Godfather/Sopranos pastiche, and San Andreas is rooted in 90s West Coast gangsta culture and ends with a re-enactment of the LA riots. In addition, almost all the necessary violence in the game is directed at other criminals or (usually-crooked) cops; violence against random innocents is pretty much entirely up to the discretion of the player. And shit, we've all got that choice to make in our real lives.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Slamming GTA for its violence misses the point entirely: at heart, GTA is an ironic commentary on violence in American media. That&#8217;s why Vice City is a Scarface/Godfather/Sopranos pastiche, and San Andreas is rooted in 90s West Coast gangsta culture and ends with a re-enactment of the LA riots. In addition, almost all the necessary violence in the game is directed at other criminals or (usually-crooked) cops; violence against random innocents is pretty much entirely up to the discretion of the player. And shit, we&#8217;ve all got that choice to make in our real lives.</p>
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		<title>By: Marcus L.</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53728</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus L.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 22:10:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53728</guid>
		<description>GTA represents at least 20+ hours of entertainment.  Many GTA fans play it continuously for months.  Talk about value.  Much better value than a movie ticket.

I saw the GTA4 demo and it looks good.  Real REal good!  (Sorry Iron Man but your days are numbered! -  Especially since GTA has the New York/Sopranos vibe going.  Plus the realism factor.)  Vice City was kind of cartoony but you could have fun soaking up the Miami sun just driving around listening to the radio -- not killing anyone!

But I won't be buying GTA4 because I don't want to shell out hundreds of extra dollars for the hardware.  On another note, the violence is pretty deplorable.  It was an issue before but I just thrust myself into it and enjoyed it.  but I've evolved a bit (I like to think) and don't want to put junk food into my brain.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>GTA represents at least 20+ hours of entertainment.  Many GTA fans play it continuously for months.  Talk about value.  Much better value than a movie ticket.</p>
<p>I saw the GTA4 demo and it looks good.  Real REal good!  (Sorry Iron Man but your days are numbered! -  Especially since GTA has the New York/Sopranos vibe going.  Plus the realism factor.)  Vice City was kind of cartoony but you could have fun soaking up the Miami sun just driving around listening to the radio &#8212; not killing anyone!</p>
<p>But I won&#8217;t be buying GTA4 because I don&#8217;t want to shell out hundreds of extra dollars for the hardware.  On another note, the violence is pretty deplorable.  It was an issue before but I just thrust myself into it and enjoyed it.  but I&#8217;ve evolved a bit (I like to think) and don&#8217;t want to put junk food into my brain.</p>
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		<title>By: Marcus Leach</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53701</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus Leach</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 20:20:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53701</guid>
		<description>Great story, but the hardware numbers are a little low; and third-party game supporters are excluded, which is another billion dollar industry.

By third-party game supporters I mean the thousands game server providers for online gaming, and software makers such as teamspeak, xfire, and ventrilo. 

This also doesn't include the millions of dollars people pay for membership into leagues such as CEVO, Major League Gaming, etc. etc. 

Not to mention, there are no high dollar actors to pay. The highest pay gamer in the world (John Wendell aka Fatal1ty (sp)) - makes around 120k a year, which is chump change by Hollywood standards.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great story, but the hardware numbers are a little low; and third-party game supporters are excluded, which is another billion dollar industry.</p>
<p>By third-party game supporters I mean the thousands game server providers for online gaming, and software makers such as teamspeak, xfire, and ventrilo. </p>
<p>This also doesn&#8217;t include the millions of dollars people pay for membership into leagues such as CEVO, Major League Gaming, etc. etc. </p>
<p>Not to mention, there are no high dollar actors to pay. The highest pay gamer in the world (John Wendell aka Fatal1ty (sp)) - makes around 120k a year, which is chump change by Hollywood standards.</p>
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		<title>By: Josh Goldstein</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53698</link>
		<dc:creator>Josh Goldstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 20:14:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53698</guid>
		<description>The "loathsome" comment also caught my eye. I think the generations who didn't grow up with Nintendo and Sega don't understand video games, much like how their parents didn't understand rock and roll. 

That which is unknown and threatening = loathsome, the devil, the root of all evil, etc...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The &#8220;loathsome&#8221; comment also caught my eye. I think the generations who didn&#8217;t grow up with Nintendo and Sega don&#8217;t understand video games, much like how their parents didn&#8217;t understand rock and roll. </p>
<p>That which is unknown and threatening = loathsome, the devil, the root of all evil, etc&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Outdoor Movies</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53682</link>
		<dc:creator>Outdoor Movies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 19:33:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53682</guid>
		<description>I can't wait till GTA4 comes out. it's going to be such a sweet game. I'm one of those people that goes first day and wait in line to pick it up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t wait till GTA4 comes out. it&#8217;s going to be such a sweet game. I&#8217;m one of those people that goes first day and wait in line to pick it up.</p>
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		<title>By: manny</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53665</link>
		<dc:creator>manny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 18:45:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53665</guid>
		<description>'loathsome GTA'? Have you ever once played ANY of the GTA series? I love that people bash those games, which are marketed and sold only to the R-rated set NOT kids, but when Scorcese comes out with his latest gangster opus with people getting their heads chopped off graphically with shovels or whatever, it's art. 
Utter nonsense. GTA is a great game for the adult set; oh and it is a LOAD of fun. More fun than the last 3 Scorcese 'films' ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;loathsome GTA&#8217;? Have you ever once played ANY of the GTA series? I love that people bash those games, which are marketed and sold only to the R-rated set NOT kids, but when Scorcese comes out with his latest gangster opus with people getting their heads chopped off graphically with shovels or whatever, it&#8217;s art.<br />
Utter nonsense. GTA is a great game for the adult set; oh and it is a LOAD of fun. More fun than the last 3 Scorcese &#8216;films&#8217; <img src='http://admin.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: The Hague</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53588</link>
		<dc:creator>The Hague</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 15:37:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53588</guid>
		<description>Games, at a minimum, are a 10 hour experience.

60 bucks, 10 hours, 6 bucks/hour entertainment cost.

Not a bad value. No one mentions this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Games, at a minimum, are a 10 hour experience.</p>
<p>60 bucks, 10 hours, 6 bucks/hour entertainment cost.</p>
<p>Not a bad value. No one mentions this.</p>
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		<title>By: Game guy</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53584</link>
		<dc:creator>Game guy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 15:20:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53584</guid>
		<description>Right now, there is a sea change going on in games where you have companies realizing greater and greater profits and deciding that they're not going to spend $10 million on a game to make $12 million back anymore, which is what the game business model has been for years - leading to many more big failures as people crowd onto those important, pre-Christmas dates.  Unlike movies or music, where someone'll download a new album or go to a new movie almost every other week (in a certain age demographic), games are more expensive and somebody might take - say - an entire month before they get sick of "Call of Duty 4" meaning that the games that hit the following three weeks tanked.

Also, bizarrely, because there are so many games, the industry and marketing are almost entirely reviews-driven, meaning that a handful of influential reviewers giving something an "8.9" or whatever impacts sales exponentially.  Games are budgeted to that - with a VP commonly saying something like, "Let's go for a 90th percentile" on this game and spend more money knowing that if the aggregate rating on a game (in a ten "star" type system) is in the top 10 percent, then it'll sell as there are legions of game buyers who will only drop that kind of cash on something that's been signed off on by the critics.

Yes, it's bizarre.

Look at the Activision/Vivendi merger, which earlier this month was approved by the SEC and - today, I believe - was approved by the EU.  You have big, huge, profitable Vivendi who has a ton of money due to one single game - "World of Warcraft."  This game and the mountains of money they make off of it allows them to release tons and tons of those "$10 million hoping to make $12 millon, but more often making $3 or $4 million" games each year.  They are merging with - or more accurately, purchasing Activision with all that money functionally to replace their low margin infrastructure with Activision's tradition of much fewer titles, much higher budgets and much better quality and sales.

Kind of like the perception of Paramount when they bought DreamWorks hoping to replace all their creative types with the DreamWorks brand.

Vivendi will probably lay off tons of people to be replaced by Activision folks and you will see a more streamlined (read: shareholder friendly) portfolio moving forward as - like in the movie business - profits are put ahead of creativity.

It was bound to happen as just too much money is being made out there for a whole slew of MBAs to attach themselves, kick out the actual game-playing nerds who started the companies and use buzzwords like "maximize audience share" et. al.

You have to wonder if, say, a real masterpiece like "Bioshock" will actually even have a place in the new business world of video games when the people holding the purse strings become like Hollywood agents who only actually go to movies when they're a client's or to be seen at a premiere - never really just for a Friday night's enjoyment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right now, there is a sea change going on in games where you have companies realizing greater and greater profits and deciding that they&#8217;re not going to spend $10 million on a game to make $12 million back anymore, which is what the game business model has been for years - leading to many more big failures as people crowd onto those important, pre-Christmas dates.  Unlike movies or music, where someone&#8217;ll download a new album or go to a new movie almost every other week (in a certain age demographic), games are more expensive and somebody might take - say - an entire month before they get sick of &#8220;Call of Duty 4&#8243; meaning that the games that hit the following three weeks tanked.</p>
<p>Also, bizarrely, because there are so many games, the industry and marketing are almost entirely reviews-driven, meaning that a handful of influential reviewers giving something an &#8220;8.9&#8243; or whatever impacts sales exponentially.  Games are budgeted to that - with a VP commonly saying something like, &#8220;Let&#8217;s go for a 90th percentile&#8221; on this game and spend more money knowing that if the aggregate rating on a game (in a ten &#8220;star&#8221; type system) is in the top 10 percent, then it&#8217;ll sell as there are legions of game buyers who will only drop that kind of cash on something that&#8217;s been signed off on by the critics.</p>
<p>Yes, it&#8217;s bizarre.</p>
<p>Look at the Activision/Vivendi merger, which earlier this month was approved by the SEC and - today, I believe - was approved by the EU.  You have big, huge, profitable Vivendi who has a ton of money due to one single game - &#8220;World of Warcraft.&#8221;  This game and the mountains of money they make off of it allows them to release tons and tons of those &#8220;$10 million hoping to make $12 millon, but more often making $3 or $4 million&#8221; games each year.  They are merging with - or more accurately, purchasing Activision with all that money functionally to replace their low margin infrastructure with Activision&#8217;s tradition of much fewer titles, much higher budgets and much better quality and sales.</p>
<p>Kind of like the perception of Paramount when they bought DreamWorks hoping to replace all their creative types with the DreamWorks brand.</p>
<p>Vivendi will probably lay off tons of people to be replaced by Activision folks and you will see a more streamlined (read: shareholder friendly) portfolio moving forward as - like in the movie business - profits are put ahead of creativity.</p>
<p>It was bound to happen as just too much money is being made out there for a whole slew of MBAs to attach themselves, kick out the actual game-playing nerds who started the companies and use buzzwords like &#8220;maximize audience share&#8221; et. al.</p>
<p>You have to wonder if, say, a real masterpiece like &#8220;Bioshock&#8221; will actually even have a place in the new business world of video games when the people holding the purse strings become like Hollywood agents who only actually go to movies when they&#8217;re a client&#8217;s or to be seen at a premiere - never really just for a Friday night&#8217;s enjoyment.</p>
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		<title>By: T. Barnes</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53578</link>
		<dc:creator>T. Barnes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 15:05:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53578</guid>
		<description>The fact that games are more profitable than features pretty well known, at least from the POV of the geeks I run with. Gaming companies may charge more than the box office, but there's infinitely more hours of entertainment so basically there's more bang for your buck.  Ever played a game, Nikki? They're so much fun. However, comparing games to movies doesn't quite compute. :-D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The fact that games are more profitable than features pretty well known, at least from the POV of the geeks I run with. Gaming companies may charge more than the box office, but there&#8217;s infinitely more hours of entertainment so basically there&#8217;s more bang for your buck.  Ever played a game, Nikki? They&#8217;re so much fun. However, comparing games to movies doesn&#8217;t quite compute. <img src='http://admin.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':-D' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: kevin</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53576</link>
		<dc:creator>kevin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 15:02:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53576</guid>
		<description>Wait wait wait... Nikki gets a bee up her keister about every slasher flick that comes down the pike, but when it comes to GTA all she can opine is 'hey, this thing is huge and video games are big time!'?  I love GTA games, but they are a thousand times more depraved that the worst bit of "torture porn".  I don't even know if that's a double standard.  More like a no-standard.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wait wait wait&#8230; Nikki gets a bee up her keister about every slasher flick that comes down the pike, but when it comes to GTA all she can opine is &#8216;hey, this thing is huge and video games are big time!&#8217;?  I love GTA games, but they are a thousand times more depraved that the worst bit of &#8220;torture porn&#8221;.  I don&#8217;t even know if that&#8217;s a double standard.  More like a no-standard.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Dobrofsky</title>
		<link>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53486</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Dobrofsky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 09:59:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/gta-iv-countdown-are-games-bigger-than-movies-one-expert-analyzes/#comment-53486</guid>
		<description>No doubt they are. And it's only going to become more so as the games develop into movies of their own. Plus, it does help that some games' plots are better written than a lot of scripts these days. Maybe the best writers went to the game industry? ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No doubt they are. And it&#8217;s only going to become more so as the games develop into movies of their own. Plus, it does help that some games&#8217; plots are better written than a lot of scripts these days. Maybe the best writers went to the game industry? <img src='http://admin.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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